Equality between arcane casters - Bards & Sorcerers too.

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MilouOpo
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Equality between arcane casters - Bards & Sorcerers too.

Postby MilouOpo » Thu Apr 12, 2018 3:28 pm

Some of the Prestige Classes have a requirement of certain ability in arcane casting which forces the character to have some Bard, Sorcerer or Wizard levels. At the moment the NWN’s game mechanics are not really handling the level up, as it would happen in the regular DnD rule set.

During a level up a character gains new spell slots without any kind of learning.The learning of new spells has been left out and thus the character does not truly advance in his base class.
Outside NWN the idea of this mechanism is far from unclear, as it has been gradually clarified in numerous sourcebooks to include the following:
…the character gains new spells per day (and spells known, if applicable) as if she had also gained a level in a spellcasting class she belonged to before adding the prestige class. She does not, however, gain any other benefit a character of that class would have gained (improved chance of controlling or rebuking undead, metamagic or item creation feats, hit points beyond those she receives from this prestige class, and so on), except for an increased level of spellcasting. If a character has more than one spellcasting class before becoming a Example Prestige Class, she must decide to which class she adds the new level for the purpose of determining spells per day.
The above has been worded in different ways throughout the books, started from the simple phrasing:
…the character gains new spells per day as if she had also gained a level in whatever arcane spellcasting class she belonged to before she added the prestige class. She does not, however, gain any other benefit a character of that class would have gained. This essentially means that she adds the level of Example Prestige Class to the level of whatever other arcane spellcasting class the character has, then determines spells per day and caster level accordingly.
More recent editions show the longer, more specific explanation above this.

The crippled way the NWN’s script handles level-ups does not really hinder the Wizard class, as Wizards can add another page to their spell book via scroll use (this process merely takes time in this setting), but Bards & Sorcerers are castrated because of this, not benefitting at all of the increased ability unless a metamagic feat was chosen - a somewhat expensive and non-efficient way to try to compensate flaws of the game engine.

Is there some reason to prevent the spell casting development of other arcane casters than Wizards, or would it be plausible to just fix the flaw and let the community to enjoy the real potential of all arcane classes?

The problem is easily solved by DM adjustment, if the immersion of DnD rules in this context - and equality between arcane casters - is desired.

Any opinions? Moves for, or against?


Cheers,

-M_

Ps.
Quotations from DnDWiki.com for the sake of convinience.
Solomon Ravenlocks - Elderly gent, mystified by magic and good food
Maenthaliel Dur'Morvel - Reclusive elf, apparently likes woods and subterfuge

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blatob
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Re: Equality between arcane casters - Bards & Sorcerers too.

Postby blatob » Fri Apr 13, 2018 4:07 pm

NWN is computer game, and, thus, significantly different then PnP. It is, if you will, a compromise.

That being said, personally, I could agree with you. However, the main question is can this be done in game? With scripts and so on in mind?

Loreweaver
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Re: Equality between arcane casters - Bards & Sorcerers too.

Postby Loreweaver » Sat Apr 14, 2018 7:48 am

I think it would be very unwise to make a core process like leveling up / PC mechanics dependant upon DM support, so any time a DM awards a PC a new spell it will be because the character has taken the initiative and risks to earn it rather than to fix a perceived class imbalance or a mismatch with pnp rules.

Choosing a metamagic feat can indeed help to take advantage of all potential spell slots, and is a much better choice for sorcerers and bards than it would be in pnp because you'll find no rods and no effect on casting time. While this is a fairly expensive option now, once the E8 system is implemented characters will be able to acquire many more feats than they can today - both metamagic and ones which grant extra known spells outright.

MilouOpo
Posts: 9
Joined: Sun Mar 04, 2018 11:01 pm

Re: Equality between arcane casters - Bards & Sorcerers too.

Postby MilouOpo » Sat Apr 14, 2018 10:51 am

I am inclined to think that the point I've raised has nothing to do with spells gained as rewards for other reasons than accumulated XP. Those known spells are not rewards, but part of a leveling up - a thing that is not currently supported in NWN.

The levels affected are 5-8 and thus the real demand for DM support would be extremely rare by all accounts.

Countless other modifications have been made towards PnP world, which is wonderful. I'd hope that this change would be done as well, as it doesn't really require anything else than DM presence, after a player has been active on the server more than three months. With that in mind, the support would be needed four times per character - at maximum - and those events would be spreaded on the time period longer than six months. Surely such would not be an impossible task from time management perspective.

Perhaps the whole thing could be scripted via crafting menu interface or perhaps something along the lines that rangers' fighting style uses, if the DM support on these rather rare occasions is deemed as problematic?
Solomon Ravenlocks - Elderly gent, mystified by magic and good food
Maenthaliel Dur'Morvel - Reclusive elf, apparently likes woods and subterfuge


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